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Thursday, January 26, 2006

A new dawn

The following advertisement by Israeli peace group Gush Shalom will appear in Haaretz on January 27:

"With Hamas entering the Palestinian parliament, and perhaps the Palestinian government, there presents itself a historical opportunity to include this movement, with its leaders, members, sympathizers and voters, in the peace process. Any peace agreement so reached will be stronger and more durable.

"Every Palestinian group that talks with the Government of Israel does thereby recognize the State of Israel in practice.

"In the past, that applied to the PLO. The same way, it applies now to Hamas."

For more information on the Palestinian elections, see here, here and here.

Leading Israeli journalist Amira Hass expresses the sentiment of the election:

"The elections taking place today in the Palestinian Authority are fluctuating between two poles: The Israeli occupation and its tremendous involvement in Palestinian lives, and the responsibility that the occupied have for their own lives. The world, led by Israel, loves to forget that the Palestinian parliament and government, despite their respectable name, are not state institutions, and that the PA enclaves are not independent."

16 Comments:

Blogger Ibrahamav said...

When they find out that what was offered to Arafat is no longer on the table, fireworks will occur.

Thursday, January 26, 2006 3:01:00 pm  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Religious Zionism, as preached by NK, envisions a 'greater' Israel when the messiah comes. But NK is less than 1/10 of 1 percent.

Hamas openly preaches Genocide. Hamas is supported by the majority of Palestinian people. Therefore, the majority of palestinian people want...

No similarity whatsoever.

Friday, January 27, 2006 1:12:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

He isn't clueless, he is playing the shill.

Khazars, "greater" Israel, never heard of Zundel, just curious...

Do you see who this addamo-filled person is?

Friday, January 27, 2006 2:46:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Is this an admission of ignorance on eddie's part? Or just typical baiting technique so well learned from the Duke camp?

Friday, January 27, 2006 3:46:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

And the point is, for dear clueless eddie's edification:

Religious Zionism, as preached by NK, envisions a 'greater' Israel when the messiah comes. But NK is less than 1/10 of 1 percent.

Hamas openly preaches Genocide. Hamas is supported by the majority of Palestinian people. Therefore, the majority of palestinian people want...

There is no similarity whatsoever between the desires of the Palestinian people as expressed by their elected leadership and the desires of NK.

Friday, January 27, 2006 3:48:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Regardless of the origination of Hamas, what is of concern is that they openly preach genocide and are officially supported by the majority of the palestinian people.

That means that the majority of the palestinian people openly advocate genocide.

I'm sure everyone regrets introducing your parents, but there is nothing that can be done about that now.

Friday, January 27, 2006 5:47:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Nice try? Actually, it was a bullseye.

Seems the dog will have to be put down, especially as it has become rabid.

Friday, January 27, 2006 5:52:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Doesn't look like there is a dirty spy ring at all.

Not that antisemites are concerned about the truth.

Friday, January 27, 2006 6:32:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Then They Came for Me
January 27, 2006
The Justice Department's investigation of two pro-Israel lobbying officials in Washington, shrouded in mystery for much of the past year and a half, is rapidly gaining some clarity as the case moves toward trial. As the fog lifts and the facts of the case become clear, some of the more paranoid conspiracy theories that have been circulating over the months are going to look mighty foolish. On the other hand, the facts might give us some brand-new reasons to be scared.

The investigation became public in August 2004, when CBS News reported that the FBI had a "full-fledged espionage investigation under way." The probe involved a "suspected mole" in the Pentagon allegedly passing secrets to Israel via officials of the vaunted pro-Israel lobbying organization, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee. The CBS report launched a frenzy of chattering among anti-Israel types who decided it was another Pollard case, final proof that Israel and its friends in this country represent a looming security threat.

Over the months, leaks and disclosures from the closely guarded investigation began to paint a very different picture. The "mole" was no agent-in-place, but a loyal (and non-Jewish) Pentagon official alarmed at the course of American policy. Nor was there any "espionage"; the Pentagon aide, Lawrence Franklin, evidently hoped to reach his own higher-ups by sidestepping the chain of command and sharing information with well-connected lobbyists, something that happens every day in Washington. As that picture became clear, it helped fuel a whole new conspiracy theory among pro-Israel activists convinced the entire investigation was driven by a single FBI agent with an anti-Jewish agenda.

But the investigation has continued and broadened in reach, costing the federal government millions of dollars and thousands of man-hours. The one-rogue-agent theory, however plausible to begin with, could not stand up in the face what was clearly a full-court press by the federal government. But what were the feds after?

Control, it seems. As Ori Nir reports on Page 1, the government's increasingly public actions in the case make it plain that its goal is to deter leakers and tighten its hold on classified information. The plan, legal scholars are increasingly convinced, is to stake out new legal ground and extend government secrecy laws, making private citizens accountable for violations that were previously enforceable only on government employees.

Under American law as it now stands, a government employee can be punished for leaking classified information, but private citizens can?t be sanctioned for receiving it. If private citizens could be punished, it would have an enormous chilling effect on the ability of the press and the public to expose government wrongdoing. And that, it seems, is the point.

Friday, January 27, 2006 6:57:00 am  
Blogger Roslyn Ross said...

The win by Hamas is one of the most positive things to happen in recent years ... that and the exit of Sharon from the scene although I would have wished retirement not illness on him.

In this part of the world what people say and what they really want and are prepared to do are different things. Beyond the issue of 'face' and both Israelis and Palestinians suffer from this limitation, Hamas will be so keen to hold on to political power that it will discover a level of pragmatism it did not know it had.

Rightly so. Hamas has already said it is prepared to maintain a ceasefire and negotiate. The mere fact that it will negotiate means that it recognises Israel exists as an entity and changes to its 'charter' will no doubt come.

In the same way that Israel has stated it opposes a Palestinian State, but, when push comes to shove, will change its 'charter' so too will Hamas.

The reality is they are stuck with each other and the signs coming out of Tel Aviv is that that reality is dawning on the post-Sharon Israeli Government.

The Palestinians know it too. They elected Hamas because Fatah through the years has achieved absolutely nothing. To be fair, it was almost impossible for them to achieve much, but they can be held responsible for their corruption.

Hamas has actively worked to make people's lives better. They have seen the results. Of course they vote for Hamas. Hamas is also not purely Islamic .... Christians are also represented.

When all the huffing and puffing and rhetoric dies down I am sure that most people will see that the greatest opportunity for peace and resolution in this miserable and bloody conflict has now appeared.

To the naysayers I would only remind you: If Sharon could be seen as a 'hawk' and 'warrior' capable of getting things done as others could not, then why not Hamas? They fit the same mould in terms of being prepared to use any level of aggression to achieve their end. The trick is to make sure peace is the end.

Sharon did not want peace he wanted victory. Let's hope Hamas want peace and not victory.

Friday, January 27, 2006 7:19:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

hamas is echoing the Arafat philosophy - Talk peace in English, war in arabic.

Nothing new.

Surely the palestinians will never separate from their genocidal dreams.

Friday, January 27, 2006 8:00:00 am  
Blogger Roslyn Ross said...

The Palestinians will never settle from their dreams of freedom until they have thrown off the yoke of the occupier.

If your nation were occupied would you do differently? I doubt it.

Why should Israel get to live in freedom as a recognised state and the Palestinians get to live under vicious occupation and continued colonisation?

Any one with a shred of integrity would support freedom to live for each side. Once Israel acknowledges the wrongs done in its creation and makes redress and the Palestinians accept, as other colonised peoples have done, that this is where they are at, then both can move forward.

Given that more than three times as many Palestinians have been killed by Israel than Israelis killed by Palestinians, just where do you think the 'genocidal' finger really points?

Not that you do think. My mistake. Might stumble on some truths and realities that way.

Friday, January 27, 2006 8:57:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

For those who are to dumb to read it the first time: Hamas is echoing the Arafat line - Talk peace in English, Talk genocide in Arabic. Understand? Ally? Who said ally?

As the Palestinians are determined to kill the Jews (even electing a body whose charter demands it), it certainly is very racist of them.

That the palestinians are incompetent does not excuse them their genocidal desires.

Here is how the addamo theory of "excused genocide" works - "because the man could not aim straight, he can't be guilty of attempted murder."

Friday, January 27, 2006 9:21:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

There you go, guessing again. Skimmed off some islamofascist website? Duke.com?

And the addamo gets thick in here.

Friday, January 27, 2006 9:35:00 am  
Blogger Roslyn Ross said...

addamo
Well said. Ibrahamav like all the rest completely ignore the fact that the Palestinians live under occupation. Not only that, it is a brutal, vindictive occupation and it is used for continued colonisation.

Unfortunately, until Israel ends the occupation, ends colonisation and makes redress it is morally bankrupt.

You could have argued your case IF Israel had been a benign occupier and IF Israel had not carried out a process of colonisation and IF Israel demonstrated it was working actively for the betterment of life for Palestinians instead of destruction of all that they have...

but you can't. That means in this instance the Palestinians are the victims and the Israelis the aggressors.

Your hypocrisy is a sign of your denial and ignorance. While Sharon blew sunshine up various orifi he was embarking on the biggest programme of settlement building .... colonisation .... that had been seen in the occupied Territories. Not only that, he was sending his troops to systematically destroy the Palestinian infrastructure: that means any capacity for policing, any capacity for governmental control, any capacity for schooling, any capacity for living anything approximating a normal life.

One of the things that will truly shame Israelis and their supporters is the level of petty, meanspirited, vindictiveness that Israel's army has perpetrated upon the Palestinians. It has come out to a degree but, in time, it will be so transparent that even those in the depths of denial will have to admit to it.

Israel not only owes the Palestinians billions for the land it took and the homes it took but it owes a huge apology for the barbarity of its occupation.

Actually the international community owes reparation to the Palestinians too for supporting the injustice of partition and turning a blind eye to the atrocities perpetrated by Israel.

So too do other Arab nations owe the Palestinians reparation and apology for their lack of support through these decades of suffering.

Truth will eventually out.

Needless to say I think the international community has a lot of apologising to do it is just that we are talking about Palestine here.

Tibet, Chechnya, Nepal, Zimbabwe, Irian Jaya are just a few of the others who have been betrayed by those in our world who have any power to stop injustice and bring about change. Sadly, the list is much longer.

Palestine is probably the most important because it has the greatest potential to escalate into disasterous conflict given the aggressive nature of Israel, the fact that Israel is armed to the teeth and the fact that the US supports Israel right or wrong because it wants to control Middle Eastern oil.

Whatever one's thoughts on the rights and wrongs of this issue, everyone should be wishing, or praying if that is their wont, for peace and for talks to begin between Israel and Palestine.

Friday, January 27, 2006 9:39:00 am  
Blogger Roslyn Ross said...

The you could have argued your case in the last post was addressed to ibrahamav. I should have specified.

Friday, January 27, 2006 9:40:00 am  

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