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Name: Antony Loewenstein
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Monday, October 03, 2005

Short-term thinking

"Mass arrests such as those of last weekend, and the targeted assassinations, of course, make Hamas move backward, and strengthen its extremist wing. Since it is a movement that has won the admiration and respect of the masses, Israel's struggle against it must not take on a solely military character. An exclusively military campaign would not help. On the contrary, it would weaken Fatah and Abu Mazen and would fortify his opponents."

Danny Rubinstein, Haaretz, October 3


Blogger Andjam said...

What other wings does Hamas have?

Monday, October 03, 2005 10:21:00 pm  
Blogger leftvegdrunk said...

Andjam, Hamas' "other wings" conduct charitable and social activities in addition to the work of the UN's mission in Gaza. These programs include running religious institutions, medical facilities, education programs, and efforts to meet the social needs of the area's residents. Much of Hamas' support among working class Palestinian families is due to these programs. Like most political organisations, Hamas is far from monolithic, either structurally or ideologically. While some view these social programs as propaganda, they make a significant contribution to the lives of many Palestinians struggling for a normal existence while under occupation.

Tuesday, October 04, 2005 11:33:00 am  
Blogger Antony Loewenstein said...

Thanks for that. Andjam's 'understanding' of the issues in the occupied territories is, shall we say, limited.

Tuesday, October 04, 2005 11:49:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

I understand the German Nazi party had conducted charitable and social activities.

Wednesday, October 05, 2005 9:02:00 am  
Blogger leftvegdrunk said...

Excellent point, Ibrahamav. You have proved conclusively that today's Palestinians - fighting for a homeland against a militarily superior occupying power - are identical to the militarily dominant, industrially powerful, genocidal, and ambitiously expansionary national government in Germany half a century ago. Well done.

Wednesday, October 05, 2005 8:11:00 pm  
Blogger anthony said...

Dirt, Ibrahamav was simply pointing out how completely sickening your view of Hamas is. Any "charitable and social activities" (if indeed they exist) are offset by its obvious (to some) program of hate. But by all means, continue to compare Hamas to the Red Cross, but dont cry when you are rightly accused of anti-Semitism.

Thursday, October 06, 2005 12:27:00 am  
Blogger leftvegdrunk said...

Anthony, who are you to throw charges of anti-semitism around like that? And show me where anyone has compared Hamas to the Red Cross. Isn't that called a "strawman"?

Thursday, October 06, 2005 2:20:00 pm  
Blogger anthony said...

I did not accuse you of anti-Semitism.

by all means, continue to compare Hamas to the Red Cross, but dont cry when you are rightly accused of anti-Semitism

I was implying that your apparent support for Hamas- or at least your effort to excuse its "other wings" as charitable, humane, and able to “meet the social needs of [Gaza’s] residents”, is bad enough, but it wouldn’t surprise me if your love of Hamas only grows into something anti-Semitic (i.e., membership). Already, your (?) view of the Iraqi ‘resistance’ is evidence you have no qualms about applauding murderers.

And yes, you did not directly compare Hamas to any philanthropic (?) organisation, but you may as well have.

Thursday, October 06, 2005 5:06:00 pm  
Blogger leftvegdrunk said...

Anthony, in short:

Andjam: What non-extremist wings does Hamas have?

DBO: Many, including education and social welfare bodies.

And from that you conclude that I am comparing Hamas to a charity like the Red Cross and have a love of Hamas.


Thursday, October 06, 2005 7:44:00 pm  
Blogger anthony said...

I thought so.

Friday, October 07, 2005 4:51:00 pm  

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