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Tuesday, November 15, 2005

Bring your documents

Desperate times call for desperate measures. The Palestine News Network reports:

"The Mayor of Bethlehem arrives in London today (Wednesday 9 November) to declare Bethlehem an open city and announce that his city is to issue a Bethlehem passport, open to anyone in the world.

"The initiative is designed to transcend the imprisonment of his city by a combination of the illegal wall and militarised fences, with only two gates to the outside world.

"The current situation is grim. The walls and fences that encircle Bethlehem have turned this 4000 year old city into a prison for its 160,000 citizens. The number of tourists visiting Bethlehem has dropped from nearly 92,000 in 2000 to a mere 7,249 in 2004. In the last five years 9.3 per cent of the Christian population of Bethlehem has emigrated. Restaurants, shops and commercial outlets have shrunk and Bethlehem’s economy is threatened."

Yet another nearly hidden side of Israel's ongoing occupation.

15 Comments:

Blogger Pete said...

But there may be benefits in terms of historical preservation AL.

No ancient hovels and shrines being knocked down to make way for the Bethlehem Hilton. No visits by Paris Hilton - there being nowhere chic to shop for plastic mangers or bling.

Slightly more seriously if Bethlehem is securely walled off by the Israelis would they be less likely to shell or bulldoze it?

Tuesday, November 15, 2005 3:59:00 pm  
Blogger Antony Loewenstein said...

Probably make no difference, sadly. The occupation is so pervasive, people, ancient buildings and the like become an irrelevance.
History will judge harshly, as it should.

Tuesday, November 15, 2005 4:09:00 pm  
Blogger Iqbal Khaldun said...

Actually, sadly, there have been 'Christian' suicide bombers.

A lot of the tour operators inside Israel say Bethlehem is too dangerous for tourists, so the local tourism industry has faultered somewhat. But Bethlehem is probably the best kept secret in Palestine. Some nice stone pubs, good restaurants, and very welcoming locals.

Tuesday, November 15, 2005 8:43:00 pm  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

History will judge the Palestinians harshly.

And which christian was that? There was the american suicide, Corrie, but she carried no bomb.

Tuesday, November 15, 2005 8:58:00 pm  
Blogger Pete said...

Igbal

Like Ibrah I'm interested to hear more about "Christian suicide bombers". Were/are they active in Lebanon?
eg. Christian bombers in Muslim crowds.

Or are you talking about random nutters who blow themselves (and others) up and are incidentally "Christians".

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 1:07:00 am  
Blogger Pete said...

Sorry, I mean't "Iqbal"

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 1:09:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

History is never kind to those who use martyrdom as an excuse to kill babies.

History has been respectful of the Jews because of the overwhelming horror and the civilized world's guilt for hardly doing a thing to stop it.

It seems that the previous poster's doubts are based on something other than reality. What could it be?

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 11:01:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

I am not happy how Israeli arabs are treated in Israel. But The israeli arab is by no means disempowered.

Every single Arab country will be judged harshly for treating minorities as 4th class citizens, while Israel will stand with most western civilized countries who treat them as second class. Those countries will be judged lightly, because there is no perfect country.

I'm not proud of the Israeli record on this issue, but I am horrified, and the rest of the world is horrified at the arab treatment of those not arab and the right brand of Islam.

This is another area in which you betray your antisemitic bent.

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 2:50:00 pm  
Blogger Antony Loewenstein said...

Can the man write anything without mentioning anti-Semitism?

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 3:01:00 pm  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Antony, as half of your posts have that bent, it is surprising that your identification bothers you so much.

Denying and antisemitic bent when your writing holds so much is unbecoming. I expect the worst in people? Look at all of the suicide bombing and look who is supporting it. You can't stand oppression? Put your body between the suicide bomber and the Jewish child.

Wednesday, November 16, 2005 10:20:00 pm  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

You wouldn't need to, as no IDF soldiers are out their looking to kill 13 year old girls.

Only an antisemite would suggest such a thing.

That's right, one just did.

Thursday, November 17, 2005 1:41:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Again, you have such a problem with the statement of an Islamic Muslem commander in the field, surrounded by enemies.

He unloaded a full clip on automatic. Not single shots.

Seems your antisemitism can not let go long enough to actually comprehend the story. That is your racism talking. Too bad.

Thursday, November 17, 2005 3:46:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

The witnesses, who could be lying according to your statement, said he put two bullets in her head. Two bullets are not a burst.

Who said he did not immediately reload? It takes barely a second for an experienced soldier.

You make many assumptions not made by intelligent unbiased people. Perhaps your antisemitism has lead you down the road of hatemongering?

Putting extra bullets into a dead body is not a felony. It is unbecoming and an officer in the IDF should not do it and he should be removed from command.

But your desire to treat this as a criminal action has more to do with your racism than it does with reality.

Thursday, November 17, 2005 5:24:00 am  
Blogger Ibrahamav said...

Desecration, in a war like setting, is rarely considered criminal enough to warrent any stockade time.

In fact, one of the IDF members who testified against the officer stated he lied.

Thursday, November 17, 2005 6:43:00 am  
Blogger Iqbal Khaldun said...

Hello All,

Just a stop press about a previous comment of mine. I said that there have been suicide bombers of Christian origin in the past. That comment was based on my readings. To be precise, the recollection of something I have read. After someone queried that comment, I did some further research and indeed I was quite incorrect. Whilst there have been Christian converts to Islam who latterly became suicide bombers, and ostensibly Christian Palestinians are involved in armed resistance to the occupation, to my knowledge there has never been a 'Christian' suicide bomber (well, to the extent that a suicide bomber may be described on the basis of their religious denomination).

Apologies for the inadvertent misinformation.

Iqbal.

Thursday, November 17, 2005 7:15:00 pm  

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